Leak, bottom of front strut.

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toddao
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Leak, bottom of front strut.

Post by toddao »

Yesterday I noticed a pool of LHM under one of the front wheels, upon inspection this appears to be coming from the 'unit' that's fixed to the bottom of the strut with a metal tie and into which plugs the hydraulic overflow and vent pipes. It's a rubberised thing and the rubber seems to have perished slightly.
I can't find this thing on the service Citroen site nor in Haynes. So, does anyone know what it's called, whether it can be bought still or must I repair it? What could I use to seal it anyway that would be LHM proof?
Looking at the Service Citroen site it seems that many of the hydraulic components are no longer available.

Thankyou in advance.
Todd


this yellow writing is really hard to read

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toddao
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Post by toddao »

Sorry to answer my own question but I've found it - it's a leak back valve and apparently is still available from Citroen so I've just ordered it. Another question how do I replace this correctly?
Todd


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DLM
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Post by DLM »

Isn't that just the plain old front strut return pipe and clip, Todd? It doesn't plug in so much as sit flush over a hole in the strut. They were still available in pattern from from GSF and Eurocarparts when I last looked (the original part will last longer though).

There's plenty of reference to changing it on the site if you're willin' to keep on searching (to keep on moving..).

Useful PDF here

http://www.rwbsmith.plus.com/citroen2/Struts/

for struts in general - showing the official tool for the clip on page 5 (I think). I normally use carpenter's pincers. The clip can sometimes suffer when removing it, so a replacement clip or a reusable one from a scrapper may be a handy thing to have to hand when replacing. The clips are getting to be nearly the same price as the return pipe itself.

Some people prefer a jubilee clip instead of the original, some prefer to remove the whole strut and clean it off for ease of fitting and a better seal.

The PDF might also help answer some questions for other people arising from conversations at Stratford . A DIY strut recon page was on the old Japanese bx.org site, now archived somewhere I don't have as a link for at the moment.
Relying on two wheels and musclepower since the last BX (or any car) had to go.

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MULLEY
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Post by MULLEY »

The good news Todd is that if i can change one, then so can you :lol:
2002 C5 2.0 HDI Estate - Jasmine - Now SORN
2011 Mini Cooper D Clubman - SOLD
2016 Mercedes A180D Sport - Auto refinement
1992 TZD Turbo - Bluebell - My daily
1991 Gti 16V - Blaze - crash damaged, will get repaired.
1990 Gti 8Valve SOLD - looks like it's been scrapped
2002 Mini Cooper S - SOLD - i miss this car
1992 TXD - Scrapped in March 2014
1988 CX 25 GTI Turbo2 - SORN
1996 - AX Memphis 1.5D - Dream - SORN

I'm not just a username, i'm also called Matthew.

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Way2go
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Post by Way2go »

You've led a charmed life if you haven't had to change one (or more) of these while in BX Ownership. :) The two pipes are constantly flexing, so what with weather & LHM they are prone to early failure. The GSF ones don't seem to last longer than a few years. :(
1991 BX19GTi Auto

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toddao
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Post by toddao »

Thanks for replies. I took the precaution of ordering a new clip too when I ordered the new valve. We don't have GSF here so I usually buy from Citroen apart from when the price is three or four times as much!

W2G wrote
You've led a charmed life if you haven't had to change one (or more) of these while in BX Ownership
Yes, I was thinking that too. The suspension seems to have been the most reliable system so far, everything else having given me trouble!
Todd


this yellow writing is really hard to read

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docchevron
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Post by docchevron »

You're just asking for trouble saying things like that!
:lol: :lol:
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Far too many BX's, a bus, an ambulance a few trucks, not enough time and never enough cash...

citronut
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Post by citronut »

this is not a valve its just two pipes bonded to a rubber block and nout inside,

one is a vent and the other is a leak by pipe

it is also possible to use just the square plate from the old clip with some ligarex run through the slots in the back of the original square plate,

some very eary BX's had this from the factory

regards malcolm
curent ride
K reg BX 17TD TZD est
also own
K reg D special

no longer have
H reg CX saffari 2.5 TRI (now gone to Malaysia)
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toddao
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Post by toddao »

Malcolm, you're quite right. That was my mistake - it's listed by Citroen as 'leak back hose' not valve. Heaven knows what it is in Deutsch! I just rattled off the number on the phone to Herr Wolf at the local Citroen garage.
Yes Doc, I'll keep quiet about 'problem free suspension!' :D
At the moment I'm leaving a nice three way stain in the street when I park : a little bit of oil, a little bit of transmission fluid and a dash of LHM.
Any ideas where the transmission fluid would likely be leaking from?
Todd


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RxBX
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Post by RxBX »

Hi Toddao,
Having posted fairly recently on the same subject, I did not want to go over old ground !
But it took me a lot of deep searching to get back to the thread which it was discussed as it was buried in a thread
titled 'FRONT BUMPER SAG':roll:
Mike Holdstock wrote: Maybe i can tap your expertise since we are under the front wheel arches. Tom Sheppard has posted a great article "Grumpy front struts, easy cure" on the DIY section of this site, but I can not for the life of me see the two rubber pipes he refers to in "Fitted to the side of the strut are two rubber pipes. remove these, collapse the suspension to its lowest setting and place the ....." where are these pipes? In the engine compartment at the top or am I misinterpreting "strut"?
Many thanks to all
Mike in Sweden
MULLEY wrote:The strut is the vertical cylinder that runs from inside the engine bay where the sphere is attached, it runs through a hole into the wheel arch.

If you look in the wheel arch, you cant miss a dirty great big metal cylinder, thats the strut. On the strut are 2 rubber pipes that are attached via a clip towards the bottom of the strut which isn't viewable when looking at it directly. If you peer around the strut, you will see the 2 rubber pipes connected upto some fixed metal pipes. The rubber pipes can be gently eased off the metal one's (they'll remain attached to the strut), these are then placed in a container of lhm where it then sucks up & spits out the lhm when raising the height of the car. Dont forget to secure the container of lhm to avoid it spilling everywhere & dont overfill either. Hope that explains it?
RxBX wrote:Mike !
Mulley has already explained about the LHM strut overflow/return and vent pipes !

But if you open up THIS pdf file you will see exactly what your looking for on 'Thumbnail #1 item 9 :- as depicted in the lower left diagram and upper right hand diagram.
Also if you take a look at Thumbnail #15 and the lower right hand photo shot you will see these two rubber pipes (overflow/return pipe #5 and vent pipe #6, Also do-not cross connect these on re connecting !) which are attached to a common rubber connecting block.
Mk1 BX's were like this using two nylon ferrule connector's (one for each pipe) in my opinion this was a better design as when the pipes split it was a 5 minute job to replace the piece of rubber pipe from the nylon connector across to the metal connector pipes on the inner wing.

Unlike the all in one complete rubber moulded block and pipes which are pain to change as was fitted to the MK2 BX's :!:

:idea: So I converted my MK2 BX's set up to the MK1 design when the rubber pipes split/failed with age (Which was easy enough to do by leaving the old rubber block still attached to the strut/leg and then get a pair of nylon connector ferules to fit into the rubber block which I had from my MK1 BX's which I'd broken up for spares (You may need to trim any remnant of the rubber pipe above the block though) then just work out what the actual length of pipe from some random length of thick-wall/small-bore rubber pipe which is LHM suitable to re-connect up from the strut to fixed metal pipes on the inner wing !
The next time the pipe splits all that's needed is to keep some random rubber pipe sourced from the breakers yard off an Xantia or BX etc. say from some piping from the long lengths of return pipes etc. you can see going back to the LHM tank.

I have also used the rubber vacuum pipe from the carb to air filter box as fitted to Fix Or Repair Daily CVH engined Escort/Orions as these had a good length of straight thick-wall/small-bore rubber pipe fitted to them !

Both MK1 and MK2 BX's had the same stainless steel back plate and S/S strap which clamps the common rubber block to the strut (Which are fiddly to re-use with success so that's why the MK1 BX is a much better setup/design for these particular pipes) !

Also this LINK will give you an overview of the LHM fluid systems return/hose circuits (The overflow/return and vent pipes can be seen in the first diagram)

I hope this is of help to you Mike and maybe other forum members :D
Toddao,
As your BX is a MK1 it may have the earlier/better design set up, (unless someone has replaced them with the inferior moulded all in one rubber block and pipe design) and therefore you may only need two pieces of random rubber LHM resistant tube/piping to repair your split suspension strut vent/return pipes which is then only a 5 minute job !

Malcolm, just to clarify a point (No offense of course, As I do read your posts and I especially find the Technical content is very useful and informative for those on the forum who are not so gifted on such matters) :D.
citronut wrote:this is not a valve its just two pipes bonded to a rubber block and nout inside,
regards malcolm
The suspension strut vent/return pipes (Leak back hoses) on very early models (Possibly just the MK1's only with the separate rubber block/nylon connector/pipes set up) and possibly on the all moulded block/pipes type on the very early MK2's which did actually have a 'Ball Bearing' fitted to one side of block end where there is an internal chamber (which is still visible, as the block moulding design did not change) when Citroen stopped fitting the 'Ball Bearing' for some reason !
I can actually remember removing the 'Ball bearing' from a failed 'leak back hose' assembly to fit back into the new/replacement ones as they just had an empty internal chamber.
My guess for this 'Ball Bearing' if it was fitted to the vent/outlet would maybe to stop a possible surge of LHM fluid up to atmosphere if there was a rapid surge of fluid on the return line to the LHM tank, as the connection between the strut and rubber block has a common internal cavity to the vent/return lines, unless some else knows for sure ?

Anyhow Toddao, I hope this maybe of help to you and all the best to a quick/rapid repair !

citronut
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Post by citronut »

ok RxBX
i dont remember seeing a ball bearing this dosent mean there was not one,

but i do remember the early type of leg pipe that had two seperate pipes attatched by two nylon comnectors

the only ball bearing i do remember is in the short right angled pipe at the hydraulic tank

regards malcolm
curent ride
K reg BX 17TD TZD est
also own
K reg D special

no longer have
H reg CX saffari 2.5 TRI (now gone to Malaysia)
R reg xantia 1.9TD est (gone to meet its maker)

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Way2go
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Post by Way2go »

There definitely was a ball bearing valve in one leg of the strut return pipes even on the Mk2 GTi. I haven't checked the GSF offerings but they may well not have it.
The purpose was presumably as a one-way valve to assist in pumping the return LHM back up to the reservoir. The strut when lengthening would draw aeriated LHM in down the leg with the valve (being less resistant) and then when compressed would drive the vented/settled LHM up the other leg (valve closes in first leg) back to the reservoir? Or somehing like that anyway?
1991 BX19GTi Auto

citronut
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Post by citronut »

ok Way2go

i did not say there is not or has not ever been a ball bearing in there, i said i had never seen one

regards malcolm
curent ride
K reg BX 17TD TZD est
also own
K reg D special

no longer have
H reg CX saffari 2.5 TRI (now gone to Malaysia)
R reg xantia 1.9TD est (gone to meet its maker)

Brian
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Post by Brian »

Yes they were on the Mark 1 BX's.
Pic below.

You can't see the ball bearing, but if you shake it, you can hear it rattle.

In fact I use the valve to enable me to bleed brakes on my Visa.
No assistant required, and it works fine...



Image

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toddao
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Post by toddao »

Yes, that's the one I've still got on my TRD Brian - been there since '85 I suppose. The one I bought today from Citroen for €15 has the two return pipes fixed to it. So strictly speaking does that mean I'm replacing my 'leak back valve' with a 'leak back hose' tomorrow? :D
Todd


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